Bri Conn, CFP®: [00:00:00] Welcome to Childfree Life by Design. Today we’re talking about legal preparedness, specifically the differences between guardianship, conservatorship, and power of attorney. We’re gonna explore what it looks like to build a safety net when you don’t have a traditional next of kin. I’m Bri Conn, and I’m here with Melissa Holcombe. In this episode, we’re covering how to protect your autonomy and why having a plan in place is the ultimate gift to your future self. If you’ve ever wondered who would speak for you in a medical emergency or manage your bills if you couldn’t, this conversation will give you the clarity and tools to make intentional decisions that support the life you want.

Intro: From Childfree Insights, this is Childfree Life By Design, the go-to resource for building the Childfree life you want. Every episode gives you practical guidance, clear direction, and meaningful conversations to help you live intentionally and design a future on your terms. This podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Please consult your advisor before implementing any ideas heard [00:01:00] on this podcast.

Bri Conn, CFP®: Alright, Melissa, let’s go ahead and dive on in. Listeners, if you have not met Melissa before, she is our senior advisor over on our Childfree Trust® team. I’d like you to give a little bit brief intro to yourself though for people who might be new to you, just so they know where you’re coming from when we’re talking about all of these things today.

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Sure. Again, my name’s Melissa Holcombe. I am a licensed clinical social worker and senior advisor with Childfree Trust®. And I’ve been conducting guardianship assessments for many years now. And I have dealt with these situations within the court system for several years.

Bri Conn, CFP®: So you have a lot of take and you’ve done it, you’ve been in practice with it, you’ve gone through it. I want to just jump into things like the guardianship and conservatorship. Because when people hear those words, we often get nervous and scared. And can you break down first what these terms actually mean?

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: So, guardianship and conservatorship, both are legal terms. Think of [00:02:00] guardianship as reactionary. It gets triggered when there’s been an accident or maybe an illness or cognitive decline. And there’s a need for someone to oversee you, to oversee your finances, to oversee your person. And in the event that there are no identified people, say there’s not a spouse and there is not someone who’s been named through a power of attorney, then there’s a potential for guardianship to be filed. And it takes two people to file the Guardianship petition. From that, it goes in front of the court and there’s a whole process to it, it’s very invasive. It is a lengthy process but it does go in front of the court. And the eventuality is that it comes in front of a judge. And the judge makes the decision on who gets to basically, determine your rights.

Bri Conn, CFP®: So it’s really the two professionals go in. How do they [00:03:00] determine who’s going to be that guardian then, when you’re going in as a professional. You’ve got another professional saying, this person can no longer manage these things. But then who is going to be the person who actually steps in? I know the court decides it, but how is it decided? Is it just somebody off the street? That part feels so cloudy for many people, and I think that’s part of the scary thing.

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Right. So, when a petition is filed, again, it’s two people. And those people that file it can be friends, neighbors. They could be an entity like Adult Protective Services. It could be someone like your spouse in situations with dementia and that sort of thing. So, that can be those people go into file and then once the filing happens, two professionals go in and evaluate the person. And those professionals, depending on the state, it can be either a medical doctor or a licensed clinical social worker [00:04:00] or a psychologist. It varies by state as to who can make those assessments. So once those assessments are done, if it’s found that the person is incapacitated and incapable of making their own decisions, and that could be medical decisions, decisions a person or it could be financial decisions with property or with bank accounts. They’re two separate things, but they both can be looked at. One can be granted and the other not, or both granted at the same time. And it could also be two separate individuals that serve in those capacities. And so what the court does is first they look at the people who have filed the petition. To see if they are number one, willing to serve in that role. And then number two are capable of serving in that role. If the people who filed the petition, say it’s a neighbor that has been a close friend and maybe a church member or church friend, if they’re not willing to serve in those capacities, or they’re not able to [00:05:00] serve in those capacities, then it could very well fall to an individual that’s a professional. Someone who’s never met you or an agency like the state.

Bri Conn, CFP®: That would be hard. My worst nightmare is having the state decide somebody for me who I don’t know. Trying to make those decisions for me.

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Absolutely. The state will be the first one to say that they are a horrible guardian. That is not where they’re coming from. They would rather have someone that knows the client to serve in that role.

Bri Conn, CFP®: That’s fair. When these happen, are these permanent shifts? Can they ever be reversed? My understanding is they’re permanent.

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: They are permanent to an extent. So it’s very difficult to have a guardianship reversed. It does happen. But it’s difficult, it’s a time consuming process. You have to basically go back in, the person who is now the ward, has to go into court, file a petition to reinstate their rights, [00:06:00] and has to go through the process again of being evaluated by two professionals and then having a hearing. So there are lawyers involved, their court fees involved, the cost of those assessments, and so it can be a very time consuming and expensive process.

Bri Conn, CFP®: Okay, and that’s the guardianship, which can be financial and medical and going through all of that, that would be extremely difficult. It could be overturned, but it would be hard. Conservatorship, can you talk a little bit about that and how that term is used and also what it truly entails?

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Sure. Conservatorship is another term for guardianship of finances. So it takes that same amount of going through the court system and those evaluations and that person would have the right to, not only manage your funds, pay your bills, invest your money for you, potentially sell stocks, potentially [00:07:00] sell or transfer property. So a conservator would have the day-to-day financial duties to pay for your housing, to pay for the power bill and your food and things like that. But they also have that ability to get in there and move around your finances and your assets. There is some court oversight with that. They are fiduciaries. They have a responsibility to the state, but they’re not always licensed fiduciaries. So they have a fiduciary responsibility to the court and they have reports that they have to send to the court. But that does not mean that they’re actually bound by law in the sense of being insured and knowing what all the financial ins and outs are.

Bri Conn, CFP®: Because it could be a person that you know who ends up being your conservator.

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Yes.

Bri Conn, CFP®: They might not know what to do or how to handle any of those things. So when we [00:08:00] talk about it in the capacity of having professional step in, it ensures that the people that you’re hiring or having these roles know how to do these things. Because they’re not easy things to do. And I always tell people, think about even your own situations. If you aren’t fully confident in everything that you’re doing and you’re hiring professionals for it, then if you just have a family member or friend step in, they might not also know what to do or have any of that information. But I really wanna dive in now. So guardianship and conservatorship, primarily happens when you don’t have a plan and you don’t have things in place. Can we talk more about the reactionary versus proactiveness of the different types of preparing for your future?

Mid-Roll: As a Childfree individual who is going to manage your affairs if you can’t. Traditional estate planning often falls short for our community. That’s why we created Childfree Trust®. This isn’t just about a will. It’s about providing a [00:09:00] fiduciary solution to protecting your assets, your legacy, and your wishes with people who understand the Childfree path. Don’t leave your future up to chance. Learn more and get started on securing your peace of mind at childfreetrust.com.

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Absolutely. The best thing that you can do with making preparations is to designate a power of attorney. Power of attorney for your person, which is medical, could be called a healthcare proxy. And a power of attorney for your finances. And in doing that, they’re legal documents, they don’t require that you go into court. They are made by you, developed by you in conjunction with best case scenario, our best plans is in conjunction with a lawyer or another legal agent. And they allow you to think about who you want to serve in those roles. Who is that trusted person, that you know [00:10:00] can pay your bills and take care of all your finances and your day to day? Who knows what you want for your medical care. The things that you need and desire. The professionals that you want to see, your doctors, you wanna make sure you get to see your doctors, those sort of things. So with the power of attorney, it puts all of the power in your hands, as to the designations.

Bri Conn, CFP®: And getting that in ahead of time, you can change ’em. It doesn’t have to be forever, but it allows you to give you some time, get it done, and put people that you are comfortable and confident in for that. So what are tips that you have when going through the process and talking to people? Do you talk to people ever who you find that they are competent and they don’t meet the definition to have the guardianship petitioned, but they still need to be protected. How do you have a conversation with them and what do you tell them of what they should do?

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: So [00:11:00] when I come into contact with people who may be in cognitive decline then, we sit down and we have a conversation about what they want. It’s hard sometimes to have those conversations with family members or with people in your circle that you may need to designate as someone to take care of you. But it’s important to make the determinations of, okay, who’s going to take care of me? Who do I want to take care of me? How do I want them to take care of me? And now I need to go and talk to them about the eventuality that possibly I might need someone to take care of my finances or take care of my medical decisions. And so I encourage people to not only name that person and have a conversation with them, but also to have a backup to that person. Because what happens if you name your friend as your power of attorney, and both of you’re in the same accidents or, something happens to you and they’ve predeceased [00:12:00] you. So these are things to think about. You want to have a backup to your power of attorney that you’ve named.

Bri Conn, CFP®: Yeah, getting the backup and getting people on there is incredibly important. One of the things that we have found, and part of the reason that Childfree Trust® exists is because so many people go, we don’t know who to put down. Are you kidding me? I don’t have one person to put down. How am I gonna have multiple people to put down? And with you being the senior advisor at Childfree Trust® and having an understanding, can you talk more about how you’ve seen that step in and fill a role for people that really didn’t exist before?

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Right. So, Childfree Trust® has come into being because there is a need for people who are solo agers are Childfree. That sometimes there are no next of kin to name. Sometimes there are no close relatives or close friends to name. And that’s okay. There’s lots of people in that situation. And so with that Childfree Trust® offers [00:13:00] an opportunity for people to have a power of attorney, both for medical and financial, that is an entity that can step in and support that person, link up with the different agencies in the area and make sure that that person is taken care of.

Bri Conn, CFP®: Just for clarity for everybody listening, you do not have to have somebody to list ahead of Childfree Trust® in the documents. You can just say, Hey, they’re first in line. That way, if you are trying to create these documents right now and you don’t have anybody, you can go ahead and get them done and know you have a professional behind you to manage all these things. Can you talk a little bit more about the care documents as well? Because I know when you and I have gone through things and prepared for past webinars that we’ve done and conversations that we’ve had, that was something you really emphasized the need for the care documents because it would help in so many situations where you’ve seen it. Can you share how those would have helped you and will help you in future work?

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Absolutely. So with the [00:14:00] care documents on the Childfree Trust® website, you’re able to go in and list pretty much everything, all of your wishes. First, you go in and you put in all of your doctor’s information. So the person will know, who to contact to get your medications, who to contact for your routine exams, those kinds of things. You put in any legal entities that you’ve already gotten place, any of the insurances, you put all your billing information and everything in. So that’s the front end of it. And the back end of it is that personal aspect of the care documents. And so with that, you are looking at, how do you want to be treated? What kinds of things do you want done, in the event that you’re incapacitated? Do you want some extraordinary measures taken? Do you not want extraordinary measures taken? When you’re in the hospital, do you want to be in a particular hospital? If you are in a hospital or in a facility, who do you want notified? Are there people that you don’t want notified? Because sometimes that’s just as important. [00:15:00] And then also, it even goes into just making those plans and those wishes. If you have to be placed somewhere, if you can’t stay in your home, because all of it for everyone, I think, our whole wish is to live our lives and then one night go to sleep and then not wake up. I mean, just to be honest, that’s what most of us hope happens by the end. But the reality is the accidents happen and illnesses happen, and dementia happens. I think that the statistics on that, if I remember correctly, are 42% of people over 65 have dementia or some aspect of dementia. And so you want to make plans, in the event that you can’t age at home, where would you like to go? Where would you like to be placed? What kind of facility? The day to day things. If there is a critical illness, an acute illness of who’s going to take care of your dog? Those things are taken care of in the care plan.

Bri Conn, CFP®: Yeah, having all of that information easily together and gathered because [00:16:00] it is so important to ensure needs are still taken care of. And you’re right, many of us just do hope we go to sleep and don’t wake up. But the reality is that, that is not likely to happen. That is the rare scenario. And I would consider people who have that happen lucky because I think there’s a lot of other scenarios that can happen that are just a lot more difficult to deal with because they can be quite prolonged as well. So we’ve talked a little bit about the guardianship, the conservatorship, than the power of attorney, but just really being prepared. Main takeaway that I’m taking from this, and I hope listeners take away too, is get your documents done ahead of time if you can. It reduces the risk that you might need guardianship or conservatorship in the future. What you would say for a takeaway for listeners as well?

Melissa Holcombe, DSW, LCSW: Yes. Take the time to sit down and make those documents, get things in place. It’s better to be proactive. In the work that I do, I so often have to go in because I’m making assessments on [00:17:00] people’s capacity. And I often go in and they’ve not made any plans and they’ve gotten to a place in their lives where dementia has set in. And there may or may not be relatives or people who want to care for them or who have their best interests in mind, and they don’t have any choices. Having a power of attorney in place gives you choices, and guardianship takes those choices away. So the best case scenario is to make sure you have those in place so that you make all the choices and all of the options that you have.

Bri Conn, CFP®: Great. Thank you, Melissa. So this conversation really just highlighted how navigating this without a traditional next of kin. Independence doesn’t mean doing it alone. If you are looking to get started with Childfree Trust® and set up your own power of attorney and get that support system in place, you can go to childfreetrust.com. If you go to the events tab, we have an on-demand webinar to watch. You can also sign up for other events that we’re hosting as well and learn more [00:18:00] about Childfree Trust®. But today, that is all for this episode of Childfree Life by Design. Remember, intentionally choosing to invest in moments of joy is just as important as investing in your future. Until next time, happy designing.

Outro: From Childfree Insights, this is Childfree Life By Design, the go-to resource for building the Childfree life you want. Every episode gives you practical guidance, clear direction, and meaningful conversations to help you live intentionally and design a future on your terms. This podcast is for educational and entertainment purposes only. Please consult your advisor before implementing any ideas heard on this podcast.